Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

topic posted Wed, June 6, 2007 - 8:50 AM by  Unsubscribed
Share/Save/Bookmark
Advertisement
Hi folks, I'm wondering if anyone has any opinions about Whirlwind v. Hosa 6 channel snakes.

The Hosa has the features I'm looking for. It's 30' and has two 1/4" returns.
www.zzounds.com/item--HOSSH62

The Whirlwind is 25' (the extra 5' of the Hosa would be helpful for my venue) and has no returns.
www.zzounds.com/item--WHRMS6

That said, I really like Whirlwind cables and have no experience with the Hosa brand. The Hosa is about 50 bucks cheaper for some reason, and I'd rather spend the 50 bucks if the Whirlwind snake is going to last longer or is better quality. On the other hand, if Hosa is as good as Whirlwind, I'll get the length I want, and the returns too.

Any thoughts / experience would be helpful... Thanks!
posted by:
Unsubscribed
Advertisement
Advertisement
  • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

    Wed, June 6, 2007 - 8:59 AM
    This is because Hosa makes crap cable. Avoid buying their cable at all cost. Whirlwind is worth the extra $50 for sure.

    Or, you could always get a soldering iron and make your own, which ensure the best possible quality. The break-out box can typically be sourced or easily self-built. With a product like this, you're not likely to save a lot of $$$, since the cable would run you about $75 and the connectors another $75, plus the break-out box, but you'd get to choose quality audio cable and wire up exactly the connectors you'd want.
    • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

      Wed, June 6, 2007 - 9:01 AM
      yeah, DIY if you can, that way you can use Mogami or Canare for about the same price, but definitely Whirlwind over Hosa...
      in fact, do us all a favor, buy the Hosa too and burn it... :)
      • Unsu...
         

        Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

        Wed, June 6, 2007 - 9:09 AM
        Thank you. The Hosa is out.

        What about ProCo? Is that comparable to Whirlwind, better or worse?

        Thanks again.
        • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

          Wed, June 6, 2007 - 12:02 PM
          Hendrix and Vaughn used those cheap radio shack currly cables for tone. yea the gray ones. Just becuase it's cheap dont mean it's that bad for the guitar...yea you might have to take care not to break them.
          • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

            Wed, June 6, 2007 - 12:06 PM
            Anyway, I sent messages to both Lenny Kravitz and Eric Johnson that part of the secret to getting great tone was using weaker pickups and coil cables. The coil cables add a lot of capacitance and inductance to your signal chain, therefore, when you’re playing through a Marshall, you’re cutting back on the high frequencies. When we were doing the In Step album with Stevie, I had an endorsement with Monster Cables. They would send me all of this free stuff and I was very excited because I could manage these things for a guy like Stevie, who really didn’t even know how to wash dishes. All he knew how to do was play the guitar, but God bless him for that, because he really did something with what he knew. Anyway, I took these cables we got to Stevie and he said, “I hate these things.” I asked him, “Why, man, they’re the best cables in the world?” He said, “They pass to much electricity.” Those were his exact words, and I’ll never forget it as long as I live. “They pass too much electricity.”

            They were too efficient…

            Yeah, so he sent me out to the local Radio Shack and told me to buy every gray coil cord they had – not the black ones, only the gray ones. And I thought, “Hhmm, this freakin’ hick from Dallas is telling me this?” I got them and ran them through my capacitance meter and found out that they added like almost .05 mfd to the signal chain. That made it sound solid – it was like having a tone control, and the brightness and harshness that the Marshalls had was eliminated. There isn’t a single picture of Hendrix… back then they already had high-end cables, but there isn’t a single picture of Hendrix where you see him playing with a straight cable. Why? This is something I brought up to Eric Johnson – whether he heard me or not I don’t know, but it could be the second coming of coil cables.
          • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

            Wed, June 6, 2007 - 1:05 PM
            Coiled cheap cables for guitar is one thing, but using cheap cables in a venue is completely different. First, you aren't going for "coloring" the sound, you are trying to transparently bring what is on the stage to the audience. Making it sound like they are onstage with them. Also, a venue has lots of different acts coming in, over and over. You want cables that are going to last, and are going to pass through electricity efficiently. 30 feet is pretty long, and to get a really less powerful signal just means you'll be adding more gain at the mixer, and ontop of that raising the floor noise.
        • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

          Wed, June 6, 2007 - 1:17 PM
          I've heard of a couple people using ProCo as their snakes. Although, I'd go with the suggestions of building your own for various reasons. You get the exact amount of connections you need, whatever quality cable you want, and are able to do a lot more interesting things with normal snake cables.

          You could wind up splitting the snakes up on stage, so you have two different ones on stage left or stage right to minimize the amount of stage clutter. You could wire in Neutrik combo connectors, so you can have mic level and line level signals properly going into your mixer.

          But judging on the amount of sends/returns you need on your snake, buying one might actually be the most economical option. If you are only ordering from zSounds, I'd say Pro Co. Otherwise, there are tons of other options out there. Jade Audio, Horizon, and AV Link are a few.
          • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

            Wed, June 6, 2007 - 3:28 PM
            I've never had a problem with my Procos and my Whirlwind. I can't speak to the quality of Hosa cable, but I can tell you their connectors are cheap and prone to breakage. I've had to replace a lot of them over the years.

            The Monster Cable thing is pure snake oil. I will hand it to them, though, they have done a very good job of maintaining a mystique to go with their hefty gross margins.
  • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

    Wed, June 6, 2007 - 4:09 PM
    Not like I need to add this, but I will anyway... Hosa's cables are so lame. Back when I bought the bulk of my cables & studio gear in 1995 I spent about $400 on Hosa cables. I had to return about $50 worth because they didn't work straight off the bat. Over the years, they have developed so many shorts that I felt like I had no cables left. Their snakes seem to be of much better quality than their Orange+Grey dual cables. I have a few Hosa snakes and they still work fine 12 years later, but almost all of my Hosa dual cables are faulty now.

    The bigger problem however is that some people (Jory is one of them) who has said that using Hosa cables is like running your signals through a LowPass filter. I haven't done any tests, but I do know that they are definitely inferior. At the time though, (now's not much different) they were all I could afford.
    • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

      Wed, June 6, 2007 - 8:06 PM
      Well, I've never given specific reasons about why I think Hoser cables are lame, but they are definitely inferior.

      If they're all you can afford, then they're all you can afford. But a difference of $25-50 is definitely worth paying.

      Personally, I bought Hoser cable before I knew better. Fortunately, I was able to sell most of it to unsuspecting desperate newbies on Craigslist.

      That said, I still have a few Hoser snakes around, but I don't use them for any audio production, just for connecting gear temporarily (or on headphone-type systems).
      • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

        Wed, June 6, 2007 - 8:12 PM
        sorry i was thinking i was in the guitar group when I posted that...my mistake
        • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

          Wed, June 6, 2007 - 10:32 PM
          "sorry i was thinking i was in the guitar group when I posted that...my mistake"

          It may have been off topic in the thread, but I definitely found it interesting and relevant to the tribe...
          • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

            Thu, June 7, 2007 - 12:27 AM
            ...and the rest of us got a good chuckle out of it too. :)
            • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

              Thu, June 7, 2007 - 11:17 AM
              a friend of mine uses those live and i never new why, thanks.

              another friend told a me story of how he was trying to map out and recreate a jon bonham drum part and was sucessful but could never get it to sound the same until he figured out the one piece of the puzzle he was missing was the actual squeeking sound of the hi hat that the up and down motions would make. once he captured the squeeky mechanics of the hi hat the parts were a perfect match.

              sorry to throw a wrench in the thread but i love those stories of things being "too efficient".
  • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

    Thu, June 7, 2007 - 1:30 PM
    zzounds is not selling the 50 foot version of this Whirlwind snake...

    $30 bucks more....

    And Whirlwind is 10x better than Hosa... ;)

    eBay has some Mogami and Canare snakes....
    • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

      Tue, June 12, 2007 - 8:28 AM
      The differences between Hosa (bad) and Whirlwind or ProCo (better, but not the best)

      1. Stranded shielding vs. Braided shielding (or, at the very least, spiral shielding) - stranded is just that - strands of wires between the dialectric and the jacket. It leaves huge gaps through which EMI and RFI can enter the conductor and your audio signal. Braided gives much better coverage, even moreso if it's paired with foil.
      2. Dialectric - the material that's between the conductors and the shield. In Hosa cables it's thin and cheap and, overall, not very good in that it still conducts electricity allowing crosstalk between channels or the shield. A good dialectric will be thicker and not conduct electricity at all to keep separation between the conductors and the shield.
      3. Conductor - Hosa has, typically, 26 to 28 gauge wire, while Whirlwind and ProCo are typically 20-22 gauge. Thicker conductor (lower number) transmits the signal better.
      4. Soldering - Hosa is all molded and 'pressed' contacts (very often resulting in loose or non-existent contacts as evidenced by the poster who had to take $50 back of $300 worth of cables because they didn't work), while others use actual humans to solder the connections.

      I've done at least 4 studio upgrades where they brought me in as a consultant wondering which gear they needed to get or replace to make things sound better. I took one look at the studio and told them they didn't need any new gear at all - they just needed to replace the cables, as they were using Hosa or other crap brands. The difference, when you're talking a full studios worth (or live rig, for that matter), can be tremendous.

      Do yourself a favor - get the good stuff. Even better would be to use Canare or Mogami and make your own cables.
  • Re: Snake Question: Whirlwind v. Hosa

    Thu, July 26, 2007 - 7:23 AM
    Whirlwind definitely makes professional quality snakes that stand up to touring. If your needs are less rigorous I would suggest you take a look at Rapco next which is used in many commercial systems. I will be the lone voice here and say that Hosa does make good cables but you have to buy their better line that uses Neutrik and SwitchCraft connectors, these lesser know cables are labeled professional in their catalogue and I would avoid anything else in their audio cable line.

    Some people have recommended Mogami, I found that when I moved the mic cables I got microphonics and so I donated them to my local Community College and Community Theatre. When I need mic cables for my own use I make then form Belden Starquad and use Neutric connectors.


Recent topics in "Audio Engineering"

Topic Author Replies Last Post
Ex'pressions College- Any Opinions? Banzai! 15 December 20, 2009
Best head phones for the $ Dematerialize 13 December 20, 2009
Monitor question Oogie 6 November 16, 2009
Textbook for Audio Engineering or Electronic Music Andy 3 September 30, 2009